Reply to article by: mariposas morgan mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges <mair_fheal@yahoo.com>
Date written: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 18:44:53 -0700
MsgID:<mair_fheal-AF52F8.18445304102004@corp.supernews.com>

would you like some cheese with that whine?

Would you like me to embarass you in public again, by demonstrating you 
inablity to reason logically or factually?

please do

That's easy, just reply to this post again...

Many kinds of people from all walks of life have come forward to say that they
have seen an UFO. There have been cases of ex-presidents, governors,
congressmen, policemen, professional astronomers, airplane pilots of all types,
military officers, radar operators, and various scientists, but the vast
majority of people who take ET seriously have been medical professionals, TV
crews, publicity seekers, and gullible people.

JESSIE LONG

On the Feb 17th airing of CONFIRMATION: THE HARD EVIDENCE OF ALIENS AMONG US,
there is a scene where Whitley Strieber is giving an interview with Jessie Long.
Interlaced with the clip of this interview, Jessie is shown having a hysterical
fit during a hypnosis session recorded on 02/23/1991. The significance of
Jessie's hysterical fit is that people who are prone to hysteria are also prone
to suffering hallucinations/visions (See ON THE PSYCHOLOGY AND PATHOLOGY OF
SO-CALLED OCCULT PHENOMENA, by Carl Jung, especially paragraph 59 where a
patient is described having a vision of an encounter with a "star traveler". The
"star traveler" actually turned out to be an acquaintance of Carl's). During the
actual interview with Strieber, Jessie confesses that he was subjected to a
"sperm extraction procedure" during his encounters with some aliens or the
'grays'. The "sperm extraction procedure" is basically just another way of
saying he was sexually raped by one of the grays (or as Jessie put it, "...they
actually forced me to crossbreed with what seemed to be a female being...").
What Jessie actually seems to be confessing is that he must have a very VERY
small penis. Think about what Jessie is confessing. The grays are described
throughout various literature as being three to four feet tall with large heads
and very slight bodies, with no discernable sexual characteristics -- in other
words, they have miniscule sexual organs. A typical female gray would barely
reach my bellybutton, probably would weigh no more than about 40-50 pounds, and
would have a vagina proportionate to her size that would be far too small to
accommodate the typical penis of a typical white male. So either Jessie is
confessing that he was hallucinating or he is confessing he has an extremely
small penis. I wonder what the truth of the matter really is?

JOHN MACK

During the 1994 CSICOP conference held in Seattle, Washington, June 23 through
26, one of John Mack's star 'abduction' patients he wrote about in his book
ABDUCTION, came forward and confessed that she was a plant 'hired' by Philip
Klass and that she had never really been an abductee. She went on to say that
John was so easy to fool because he failed to rely on scientific methodology.

In my mind, these events call into question everything that John Mack has ever
contributed to the subject of alien abductions. If John Mack cannot even tell
the difference between a 'real' abduction story and a fake abduction story
planted by Philip Klass, then the issue of reality versus fantasy becomes very
relevant. John Mack seems like a very nice gentleman, but that means nothing in
regards to his work. He's just a nice gentleman who is very easy to fool when it
comes to the UFO phenomenon. And he is a very intelligent gentleman, which I'm
sure will make any of his lying patients very proud, proud to know that they
fooled someone much smarter than they are.

Not one to be easily deterred, John Mack continued on to write a second book on
the subject of abductions, where he talks about the value of what can be learned
from the meaning of the abduction experiences -- the plea for us to transform
ourselves so we can solve all our problems! If the whole point of the message is
to transform ourselves, then why all the other BS, like having sex with aliens?
More importantly, why is there absolutely no guidance given on how to accomplish
this transformation? Did it ever occur to the New Age nimwits of our day that
maybe the problem with humanity isn't that they don't realize that there is a
problem with themselves, but that they don't know how to go about changing
themselves in order to fix the problem? But I know exactly why the 'visitors'
don't give practical solutions, because they aren't real, because they are
imaginary creatures of our own making and we cannot create something from our
own imagination that knows more than we do.

And it isn't only Westerner's that are destroying the environment as Mack
alludes to, for example, the Japanese thought nothing of their recent (2000)
cold blooded murder of Willy along with many of his close relatives. Their whole
public philosophy is that the world was especially created for their own
personal exploitation. What a nice philosophy, eh? And don't forget about Iraq
or Israel and their wonderful non-western philosophies -- as if I need to say
any more along these lines that the newspapers already haven't told you. There
is nothing 'revealing' about this aspect of the ET revelations that we already
don't know. Biologists have known years before the abduction phenomenon ever
came along that, "An organism that thinks only in themes of its own survival
will invariably destroy its environment and, as we are learning from bitter
experience, will thus destroy itself". To paraphrase the mythical Jesus, 'If
they would not listen to the scientists of old, why would they listen to an
Alien Messenger come in the flesh?'.

It bothers me that I see so many Phd degreed people getting involved in UFOlogy,
so I often wonder what really could motivate so many of these kind of people to
flock to a discipline of such ill-repute. But then I thought (in regard to John
Mack at least), which would give a better chance to discover fame or fortune:
practicing psychiatry or UFOlogy? UFOlogy seems to me to be a more sure-fire hit
compared to psychiatry. Think about it: when was the last time you heard a
famous psychiatrist in the media as compared to a famous UFOlogist?

PHILIP KRAPF

I know that in the past I confessed to having a crush on the lovely sounding
Verdant named Gina from Philip Kraph's book, THE CONTACT HAS BEGUN, but, like I
also confessed, that didn't mean I was stupid or gullible enough to believe
anything that Philip reported as being the truth or fact. I was just being
honest enough to admit that I had fantasies and I at least didn't confuse my
fantasies with reality, no matter how alluring they might be. On October 1st of
1998, only just a few months after Philip released his first book, CNI News
posted an article (Re: Vol. 4, No. 15, Part 1) titled, LUNCH WITH GERSTEN AND
KRAPF. In that article, Peter Gersten of CAUS, cross-examined Philip and
revealed questionable motives behind Philip's not so subtle hint of the promise
of a second book, a promise which Philip followed through on by releasing his
second book in June of 2001.

GARY LOWERY

Gary Lowery chose to sell his soul to the highest bidder and that to me tells me
all I need to know about Gary and the value system that motivates him. It
doesn't appear to me, not from Gary's actions, that he ever wanted to share his
ongoing encounters with the world to get the truth out. No, from what I can see,
he only wanted to use Peter Gersten in order to get the publicity he needed to
get offers for money and fame. I mean, whatever happened to his claim Peter
Gersten indirectly quoted from him, about wanting to learn some answers as to
what he and his family were experiencing? Is sensationalizing his supposedly
real-life experience going to accomplish that for him now -- or is that no
longer a priority? If the ET/paranormal phenomenon were physically real (as
opposed to imaginary), then one would reasonably expect that the person
asserting their alleged experience would not want to cheapen it by
sensationalizing it or selling their soul to the highest bidder, instead we
would reasonably expect that they would want to resist the media hounds and the
hush money and let the world know that they take this seriously and that this is
no joke. But it is too late, it is just another joke now.

JOHNATHAN REED

What I want to know is what kind of people would listen to what sounds like
obvious bullshit to me? Jonathan has no demonstrable artifacts, no corroborating
witnesses, and no indirect (much less direct) evidence that anything of the sort
of encounter he claims ever happened anywhere -- besides in his imagination. I
mean, I can't imagine anyone but the stupidest, most gullible, most idiotic
people in the world, listening to what I consider a very poorly told story, and
then giving him a standing ovation afterwards. Is this the real influence
Hollywood has been having on Americans? An influence that would cause them to
have no clue how to logically and rationally critique a claim but rather judge a
story only by how well the person acts out the story? So if I cry and give
slideshows and tell ridiculous stories without any accountability for any make
believe claims I might make up to support my agenda whatsoever, then the
clueless UFO believer would listen to anything I would have to say? According to
UFO WatchDog, the "Dr Reed" storytale has finally been definitively exposed as a
hoax. This doesn't look too good for all the apprently phony people who claimed
they had done all sorts of "research" on Dr Reed and "confirmed" his story to
the nth degree. Art Bell, who claims he is "more skeptical than the skeptics"
wasn't being very skeptical all these years in regards to promoting "Dr Reed",
was he? Is Art Bell driven by what makes the ratings, instead of by being
reasonably and prudently skeptical as he claims he is? Shame on him and shame on
"Dr Reed".

RICHARD HOAGLAND

I really sat up and took notice when I saw that Richard Hoagland took some
unspecified part in the debunking article put out about regarding the faked moon
landing conspiracy. What I mean is, is there no honor among thieves, ie -- is
there no honor among make believe conspiracy theorists? Now there is something
really funny -- talk about 'silly and damaging urban myths', I believe the Mars
Face conspiracy takes the cake, yet here we have the king of the conspiracy
promoters somehow taking part in performing the 'evil task' of debunking someone
else's silly and damaging urban myth. Debunking must not be so 'evil' afterall,
I guess it only becomes 'evil' when someone does it to you. This reminds me of a
bumper sticker I saw the other day that read, 'Don't lie, cheat, or steal
because the government hates competition'. Likewise, for one silly and damaging
urban myth maker to debunk another silly and damaging urban myth maker sounds to
me like conspiracy believers hate competition.

Objectively speaking, there are no 'pyramids' or 'faces' or 'cities' in the NASA
or JPL photos of Mars, just some blobs and blurry rock piles. And speaking of
blobs and blurs, do you also remember how psychologists used to often ask their
clients to interpret what they think they saw in a random blotch of smeared ink
called a Rorschach test? Well I often wondered what a mathematician or a
physicist might see in a random blotch of smeared rock piles in a photo of Mars
surface and apparently what they might see is called "hyperdimensional physics"
by some! I wonder whatever happened to the scientific method or, especially,
whatever happened to experimentally repeatable demonstration of facts, facts
that I can actually hold in my hand instead of having to wait for a, 'Just you
wait and see -- anyday now I will be proven right' kind of mentality? All I can
see for now in support of the Mars conspiracy theory is a bunch of handdrawn
lines on a photo of Mars surface, but I can find nothing on Richard's website or
writings that is based on any well known, established, and demonstratable
science, can you? You know, this brings up an interesting point: I never
understood why Richard Hoagland calls his alleged theory, "physics", when it
sounds more like an 'art' than a science -- not at all too much unlike the art
of fortunetelling, where a make believe psychic takes one look at the lines on
your hand and then proceeds to tell you your 'future' from them.

BETTY HILL

As far as the Betty Hill story goes, I find it odd that if she was lying about
it, how she could draw a map of the Zeta Reticuli system?

Betty Hill never ever drew a map of Zeta Reticuli, it was Marjorie Fish who
guessed that is what it could be. In other words, Betty Hill merely drew a
Rorschach for Marjorie Fish to use as a springboard for her imagination to draw
yet another make believe story. Sorta reminds me of the way many christians look
up at that big inkblot in the sky and think they see intelligent design behind
it when what they are really doing is re-interpreting what they wish they could
see in it.

ASTRONAUTS

Nowadays, it seems everyone wants to hop aboard the UFO bandwagon of money
making opportunities, and astronauts are no exception. These one time 'heroes'
had their day in the sun but they want to bask there forever and if it means the
possibility of catering to fringe groups, then so be it. They seemingly exploit
their credentials to curry favor from anything from voters to buyers. To me it
is just another rotten example of what commercialization can do to ethical
conscience of people, and it is also another example of meresay instead of fact
finding.

AMERICAN MILITARY AND INTELLIGENCE AGENCIES

I am fascinated by the attitude of the UFO community toward military and
intelligence agencies, which seems to fluctuate between hatred and near-worship.
My own attitude toward government agencies tends toward the cynical at all
times, and here's why...

The American government confessed to injecting innocent citizens, without their
knowledge or consent, with syphilis (as they did to black males in the fifties
and sixties), or plutonium (Rochester experiments on pregnant women during the
fifties), or my personal favorite, sent us to a jungle to die for their own egos
(Johnson's taped conversations in the White House). The CIA claimed that they
had a remote viewing program for 20+ years -- they had to admit it because it
'got discovered' by some senate investigation or the like -- and it was an
embarrassment for them but they admitted that it had been eliminated. It does
not surprise me that the CIA might try remote viewing as an intelligence tool,
any more than it surprises me that the US Armed Forces paid thousands of dollars
for a screwdriver. But a screwdriver is not worth thousands of dollars, is it?
Why would anyone want to give credibility to an organization that has been
responsible for: 

   *The Bay of Pigs fiasco
   *The Berlin Wall surprise
   *Gary Powers and the U-2 incident
   *Having their agents wear official CIA jackets with CIA logos on when helping
    rebels mine harbors in Nicaragua
   *Failing to anticipate Chinese intervention in the Korean War
   *Telling us how 'strong' the USSR was and how we had to arm ourselves against
    them, right up to the day they "suddenly and without warning" fell 
    apart...oops!
   *Aiding drug cartels in SE Asia and Central America, all in the name of 
    'fighting communism'
   *Knowingly feeding faulty information to the White House and the Pentagon 
    from double agents who were working for the USSR

The military makes blunders all the time (Tailhook, Vietnam, Rawanda, Lebanon,
numerous crashing jets), so why not when it comes to UFOs too? In fact, it gets
even worse in regards to the UFO situation, but not everything the military and
intelligence agencies does is wrong or bad. When the USAF investigated UFOs from
1947 to 1969 during PROJECT BLUEBOOK, they reached three conclusions: 

   *UFOs were not a national security risk,
   *Any sighting that could be backed up with demonstrable evidence could be 
    explained as something mundane, and
   *It was a waste of taxpayers money to continue investigating UFOs anymore.

All three conclusions were obviously indisputably correct.

Declassified documents and insiders have clearly demonstrated that the alien
presence is the #1 global security threat facing our globe. The purpose of our
sky-high military budget (not to mention the hundreds of billions of black
budget money, not accountable to Congress or the taxpayers) is simply to find a
useful counter-attack against these off-world races. Our clandestine military
program has caught up greatly over the past 30 years, but against these highly
technologically advanced ET races, the worlds citizens do not really stand a
chance if an ET race decides to 'clean the petri dish'.

That would explain why the big-ticket items in our military budget are nuclear
submarines and aircraft carriers, right? Why bother spending all that money
then? Why not just give them the cheez-whiz, or whatever they really came here
for (Wait a minute! Isn't cheez-whiz already a back-engineered alien food
product from Roswell)?

   "Who Takes UFOs & ETs Seriously? Only Every Police Station and Fire 
    Department in America!"

Number one, the people who wrote the report you are referring to, Dr William M.
Kramer and Charles W. Bahme J.D., are NOT the spokespeople for every police and
fire dept in the country. More importantly, no police or fire department is
known for their scientific credibility, and police and fire personnel are
composed of the same exact humans that are as everybit prone to mass delusions
as you and I are. So you believe everything you read without question? You
really do believe that Police and Fire personnel never lie or make things up?
Never, not even once in all of history? The police and the fire dept can assert
all they want but I will only believe in facts and not fairytales.

Number two, there is absolutely no evidence that this book is officially
sanctioned by the Executive Department of the US Government as a guide or
training manual by any, much less every, police station and fire department in
America.

Even so, the book contradicts your childish fantasies, since chapter 13 is
titled ENEMY ATTACK AND UFO POTENTIAL. Do you know what "potential" means? It
means it isn't actual. You are twisting their words around to mean "They have
proof that ETs have visited us" and should be taken seriously when in reality
the book is more a review of the anatomy of a mass delusion and how to deal with
mob control. Whether or not a real ET ever visits us, people will lose their
heads, as they often do, even if they imagine ET is visiting us, just like they
did during the broadcasting of Orsen Welles' THE WAR OF THE WORLDS.

CONCLUSION

To be honest with you, there is absolutely no legitimate scientific evidence
that there has been any alien visitations, there are only alien visions, so why
not just come out and say so? Why the run around and the games of 'the issue
isn't about the reality of this phenomenon...now here is one example of this
physically real phenomenon'? I mean if you don't want to get into the sticky
issues of reality versus fantasy, then don't throw comments out on the floor
that something is actually happening in physical reality when no one can
demonstrate anything other than a poorly told story.

The outspoken participants of this alien visitation circus don't appear to be
overly concerned with getting out the message as much as they are concerned with
book signing sessions, sequels to their last 'one-of-a-kind' book, TV
appearances, and so on. Do you really think all these people believe what
they've been telling you? The UFO phenomenon is only second to sex in number of
hits on the internet. There is a lot of incentive to join in on the UFO cash
cow, because the UFO phenomenon is a very big business. Regardless of how
credible the witnesses may be (not that it matters), their stories are never
credible. There is always some cockamaynee reason why they can never provide any
demonstratable evidence for their silly tales. But the believers and promoters
had better hurry up and drain as much money as they can because someday the
debunkers are going to abduct the believer's UFO cash cow and there will be
nothing left for them to scrounge off of anymore.

The Sage

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My Home Page      :           http://members.cox.net/the.sage

"The men that American people admire most extravagantly are
most daring liars; the men they detest the most violently are
those who try to tell them the truth" -- H. L. Mencken
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