| Subject: Re: SETI and The Fermi Paradox |
| From: BradGuth |
| Date: 02/09/2009, 05:04 |
| Newsgroups: alt.atheism,sci.astro.amateur,alt.sci.seti,alt.astronomy |
On Sep 1, 1:16 pm, Puck Greenman <dubh.gh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, 1 Sep 2009 06:32:13 -0700 (PDT), BradGuth <bradg...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sep 1, 5:40 am, Puck Greenman <dubh.gh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 09:53:18 -0700 (PDT), BradGuth <bradg...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Aug 29, 4:00 pm, "MikeToms" <t...@nospam.net> wrote:
HO-LY...SHIT !...
"BradGuth" <bradg...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:784c9cff-d39b-4819-b232-6d681229e6b0@j9g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
On Aug 29, 1:43 pm, "HVAC" <harlowcampb...@gmail.com> wrote:
"Chris.B" <chri...@mail.dk> wrote in message
news:36806e20-6abd-42c0-b12a-b031878f7d59@33g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
It is not unlikely that advanced alien races could easily cloak their
presence from us either optically or by mass psychological masking. I
am not suggesting they are doing so but it is not impossible. This
might explain the troubling differences in opinion regarding the exact
details of sightings of UFOs by experienced multiple witnesses when
the masking/cloaking/forced-amnesia system (supposedly) breaks
down. :-)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Putting your kookiness aside for a minute, consider this:
ANY craft traveling past say 50% light speed would be
visible across 1/2 the galaxy at least. The X-ray emissions
alone would mark it as an alien craft.
Where are the trails?
ET spacecraft are likely not that inefficient, although our Selene/
moon leaves a 900,000 km trail of sodium as is. Better detection of
sodium might get that worth showing easily over a million km of a
trail.
Electrostatic and magnetic forms of propulsion might go undetected
unless the ET spacecraft were cloaked like somewhat of a black hole.
A purely gravity formulated thruster/puller might be entirely stealth.
~ BG
"HO-LY...SHIT !..." might also function for ETs that haven't pissed
off God.
Could ETs survive within an icy Selene? If half as smart as a
terrestrial 5th grader, I don't see why not. Same goes for surviving
on the planet Venus, where it's geothermally hot as hell, but not
outside of what good technology could deal with.
Hotter, than Hell actually.
Hell is estimated to be about 116 *C to about 125 *C
Steel begins to soften around 425 *C.
Venus has an average surface temperature of 464 *C.
So I would be very interested to hear about this technology that can stand up to that sort
of heat.
~ BG
Electromechanical technology already exist that is suited to survive
within 811 K, and if we must venture onto the Venus surface it's
technically doable. However, a much cooler application of using a
rigid airship that's cruising at 25 to 35 km (well below those acidic
clouds) is where the first efforts should be applied, with only
limited robotic applications on the surface.
There are sufficient alloys and even some composites that are well
suited and would survive that kind of heat. Ceramics are a no
brainer, though still technically challenging. Obviously you wouldn't
use aluminum or even mild steel.
There's even plans on hold by an obscure group within NASA (meaning
public funded) that already has most everything figured out. With
their likely employment demise, of being asked to leave because of
insufficient funding, there's a good chance these same folks could be
obtained as consultants and engineers for either accomplishing their
original mission ideas or those of mine.
That assumes that cost, is not an issue.
The raw elements of Venus are worth trillions upon trillions.
But let us go with that for now.
Moving about safely in hostile environments, requires two things, protection from the
environment, and a bolt hole.
On the surface of Venus, your diving suit, if I can use the analogy, would probably be
some sort of vehicle, and your bolt hole, would be a biosphere, of some sort; yes?.
No. Human DNA doesn't care about pressure. Your physiology can
adjust to pressure a whole lot better than it can adjust to vacuum.
Both have several requirements in common, but the two that first spring to mind, are
1: Hermetic seals, capable of withstanding the heat, the corrosive atmosphere, and the
atmospheric pressure (about 1260 > 1300 psi) .
To give you an idea, 300 ft of water is about 10 bar, 140 > 150 psi
For your bolt hole, you may be able to find something that, with the aid of extensive
insulation, and minimal exposure, will suffice for a while.
Your vehicle, OTOH, will be somewhat more difficult, as all of it's external moving parts,
will need flexible protection.
Then there is your landing craft.
It will need seals which will function, both in the intense cold of outer space and in the
lead melting heat of Venus surface.
It will also need to be able to withstand ninety several atmospheres, which will make it
one very heavy baby, but it will need to be able to reach escape velocity in a very dense
atmosphere.
2: Thermal insulation.
For your bolt hole, I would suggest a tunnel, a hundred feet down in the bed rock, but
for your diving suit, I know of no technology that would give protection, and allow
reasonable mobility.
You're making more trouble and grief out of this than necessary. For
the moment, forget about waking around on that toasty surface, because
we'll obviously get to that later.
What is your expertise?
I'm an engineer.
Then we engineer, rather than procrastinate, exaggerate the negatives
and otherwise whine a lot. Start thinking like an Einstein, and just
make things happen in spite of what others are thinking.
What expertise have you of alloy and composite rigid airships? (we got
<82 kg/m3 buoyancy and only 90.5% gravity to work with)
~ BG