01 - mayor@tiac.net (Ken MacGr - Groom Lake UFO Video 02 - Mike Galloway <mike@ctaz. - Re: AREA 51: Cammo Dudes: Publication of Names and Addresses 03 - "A.J. Craddock" <craddock - Video - UFOS - Secrets of the Black World 04 - Mike Freeman <freema22@pi - Area 51: Add-on for Microsoft Flight Sim. 05 - campbell@ufomind.com (Gl - How much would YOU pay for this info? 06 - mayor@tiac.net (Ken MacGr - Re: AREA 51: How much would YOU pay for this info? 07 - John Joseph Mercieca <muf - Introduction & Reply to AJ Craddock 08 - Sia Ahmadzadeh <sia@UTSW. - RE: AREA 51: Groom Lake UFO Video 09 - Chuck Penson <penson@sci. - A fire at Groom Lake? 10 - Dave B <bethland@ix.netco - Yucca Mountain campaign 11 - tonydinkel@clubnet.net (T - Re: AREA 51: A fire at Groom Lake? 12 - Joseph C Yasinski <jcy@U. - Re: AREA 51: How much would YOU pay for this info? 13 - Joseph C Yasinski <jcy@U. - Re: AREA 51: A fire at Groom Lake? 14 - Joseph C Yasinski <jcy@U. - Re: AREA 51: Area-51 discussion IRC Channel... Index
From: mayor@tiac.net (Ken MacGray) Subject: Groom Lake UFO Video Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 11:25:56 -0400 Regarding the video that allegedly shows a UFO over the Groom Lake area <http://www.debshome.com/QuickTime_Video_Page.html>, I do have a few brief comments... Groom Lake UFO Video - Taken April 1996 A brief description of the footage, taken from Deb's UFO Research Information Clearinghouse... THIS FOOTAGE IS OF A UFO WHICH WAS FILMED NEAR GROOM LAKE IN APRIL OF 1996. DEB'S UFO RESEARCH INFORMATION CLEARINGHOUSE OFFERS THIS FOR YOUR ENJOYMENT AND ENLIGHTENMENT. WE ASSURE THE AUTHENTICITY OF THIS FOOTAGE. THIS FOOTAGE HAS NOT BEEN EDITED OR ALTERED FROM THE ORIGINAL FOOTAGE TAPED AT GROOM LAKE. IT IS OUR INTENT TO PROVIDE THIS FOOTAGE AS SCIENTIFIC PROOF. Aside from the annoying all caps text at this site, this video clip does nothing to convince me that this is "scientific proof" of UFO's in the skies over Groom Lake. I was in the Groom Lake area around the time that this was shot, and this looks like a shot of the Moon through thick cloud cover to me. The motion itself is somewhat interesting, but it cannot be determined whether it's the object or the camera that's moving, as the object appears in total blackness, with no points of reference as to its apparent size or location in the area. I respect The Deb's intentions, but this can hardly be called "scientific proof"... ============================================================= Ken MacGray, Administrator - Virtual Village BBS Central Massachusetts' Premier Online Service 508-368-4222 - email:mayor@tiac.net - http://www.tiac.net/users/mayor Area 51 Images/Lore/News: http://www.tiac.net/users/mayor/a51/a51.html ============================================================= Message #1
From: Mike Galloway <mike@ctaz.net> Subject: Re: AREA 51: Cammo Dudes: Publication of Names and Addresses Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 12:38:41 -0600 I doubt >that the Groom Lake Command feels as though security should be fixing the >flat tires of tourists, and handing out guide maps like Park Rangers!! Why Not? Now that Nevada has made the ET HIWAY a designated tourist attraction for the worlds most famous and publicized secret base. They >are the one's that are faceless and nameless and must be held responsible, >totally, for their subordinates. I do reiterate my concern that the >published information surely must not be misused to engage in a harassment >campaign against Groom Lake Security personnel. Free speech and the free >flow of information must never be discouraged. But I'm very clear on the >point that the paranoid secrecy at Groom Lake is not the responsibility of >the Cammo Dudes, but emanates from a much, much higher level of authority. >The Cammo Dudes are the manifestation of the problem, but definitely not the >source of it. > Bill, Your right of course. For the most part the Camo Dudes are just trying to make house and car payments and are caught in the middle of being "Brain Washed" by their employers paranoid Nazi "lie about everything" attitudes. I have known a few individuals who were chronic liars. There problems in life started when they can no longer desern truth from their own lies. Once they start lying it gets so automatic that they then lie about everything. The time of day, a trip to the store, and every aspect of life is embellished. They think no one knows. However, a closer look will reveal an individual that friends, spouses, and honest people don't want to be around. They think they are fooling everyone while the quality of their life goes down the tubes. Now imagine in your job description if you have to lie professionally for a living. Your employment requires you to degrade yourself. You can get a paycheck with study employment if you go along with your boss who invokes "national security" privilege. Then after you start lying everyday you also find that if you change your mind and want out, and want to tell the truth, your life can be ruined and over as you know it? I am sure that more that one Area 51 employee, Camo Dude, or even base security monitors this site. Not even suprised if they have to report how many times, and when, along with the old, "how do you feel about the pressures of keeping the heavy burden of national security secrets?" Be sincere say, "it bothers me". Then, watch your paycheck and life change as you know it! The whole situation with the Camo Dudes, Area 51, and the ET Hiway is just one big mess getting more attention everyday. It must be hard to keep the "lid on" and try to employ men of good conscious and character at the same time. If the Camo Dudes act unethical perhaps it's because only lying untrust worthy minds are in charge. A resemblance to a pirate ship and it's crew or concentration camp and its bosses. Anyway, not to beat a dead horse but you got me thinking about this again Bill. Mike Galloway Message #2
From: "A.J. Craddock" <craddock@ix.netcom.com> Subject: Video - UFOS - Secrets of the Black World Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 14:35:17 -0700 While in the UK a couple of months ago, I watched a copy of Michael Hesseman's video "UFOs - Secrets of the Black World", which I don't believe is available in the US. I seem to recall it was produced in 1995 or 1996. Just being a part-time Area 51'er, a couple of clips were new to me. One was Sean Morton's night shot of a craft landing at Area 51 in a conventional linear mode with a distinct force-field being projected in front of it, which was switched off when the craft touched down on the main runway. The other was a stolen clip from one of the security camera's on (as I recall) the 5th level down at Area 51 in the underground complex, which showed five or six gray-type ET's preserved in some kind of vertical transparent liquid-filled storage capsules. There was also an interview (by Wendelle Stevens) with the renegade security guard who was now on the run. Has anyone else seen this video, and are these items old news? Presumably the exotic craft is. Tony Craddock Message #3
From: Mike Freeman <freema22@pilot.msu.edu> Subject: Area 51: Add-on for Microsoft Flight Sim. Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 19:02:58 -0400 Just a reminder, the Area 51 add-on for Microsoft Flight Simulator 4.0 and 5.0 is available from my web page at http://pilot.msu.edu/~freema22/index.htm. Enjoy. Mike Freeman Message #4
From: campbell@ufomind.com (Glenn Campbell, Las Vegas) Subject: How much would YOU pay for this info? Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 22:55:09 -0700 [Below is a proposal I received by email, followed by my reply. Did I respond correctly? I have removed his identifying info per policy. --GC] ------- From: xxxxxxxxx@aol.com Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 00:21:11 -0400 To: campbell@ufomind.com Subject: This is not a joke How much would your organization pay, or issue a receipt for tax purposes, for a detailed map of buildings 13, 18 and 19. Buildings 13 and 18 down to the ninth level with color photographs? In addition to the above inforomation (21 pages 7 photographs), I also have a list of 39 names, phone numbers, and ranks including an active member of the joint chief's of staff. Also enclosed in the packet I received was a picture of something very strange. I am not into ufo's sir, but this ain't no f-11 in the picture. It appears that the workers are wearing what appears to be ebola virus level-4 suits.??? I am located on the web at www.xxxxxxxx.com, and my name is Xxxxxx Xxxxxx. After reading almost 40 web pages on the ufo subject, I am under the impression that the material given to me by "a freind" may indeed be very valuable. However, the longer I think of it the more scared I become in terms of how important it is to keep these items a secret. Allthough individuals like yourself may feel that the people (our people) may have a right to this information, after a carefull review of the information, and a review of the photographs, I can easily come to the conclusion that this is a matter of national security. A detailed explanation from yourself on how this information will be used by your organization would be a determining factor in my decesion to send this to the appropriate individuals or release it through your organization. I have no idea what your position is in what I will call the "ufo community", and only by reading the web sites did I come to the conclusion that your organization may indeed be a leader. Please respond in a timely manner, My consence is killing me. Sincerely, xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.-----.com p.s. I will not be interested in discussing how I received this information. --------- 16 Sep 1996 From: campbell@ufomind.com Subject: Re: This is not a joke Mr. Xxxxxxx: When someone begins a message "This is not a joke," in my experience it usually is. This is a typical phrase of the rabid conspiracy buff with little useful information. >How much would your organization pay, or issue a receipt for tax purposes, >for a detailed map of buildings 13, 18 and 19. Buildings 13 and 18 down to >the ninth level with color photographs? We would pay zero. We do not pay for information. > Please respond in a timely manner, My consence is killing me. Yeah, right. Then how come you asked for money up front? I looked at your web pages. You call yourself "a devoted Christian." ...but apparently one who is willing to cheat on taxes, as indicated above. > A detailed explanation from yourself on how this information will be used by > your organization would be a determining factor in my decesion to send this > to the appropriate individuals or release it through your organization. How can I explain how I will use the info if I don't know what it is? A minor question: Buildings 13, 18 and 19 -- OF WHAT? > p.s. I will not be interested in discussing how I received this information. Most information and photos are useless without some knowledge of their source. This _is_ a joke. Glenn Campbell +------ U F O M I N D -------+ | Glenn Campbell campbell@ufomind.com | | AREA 51 RESEARCH CENTER - Las Vegas & Rachel, Nevada | | UFOs - Gov't Secrets - Philosophy - Psychology | | http://www.ufomind.com Box 448, Rachel, NV 89001 | +------------------------------------------------------+ Message #5
From: mayor@tiac.net (Ken MacGray) Subject: Re: AREA 51: How much would YOU pay for this info? Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 05:52:21 -0400 >[Below is a proposal I received by email, followed by my reply. Did I respond >correctly? I have removed his identifying info per policy. --GC] > ------- I agree that you did respond correctly in this case. The points you raised in your reply were valid, and make the original message appear less credible... Opinions from others? ============================================================= Ken MacGray, Administrator - Virtual Village BBS Central Massachusetts' Premier Online Service 508-368-4222 - email:mayor@tiac.net - http://www.tiac.net/users/mayor Area 51 Images/Lore/News: http://www.tiac.net/users/mayor/a51/a51.html ============================================================= Message #6
From: John Joseph Mercieca <mufor@maltanet.omnes.net> Subject: Introduction & Reply to AJ Craddock Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 13:08:23 +0200 Hi all, I am a new subscriber to this list and I am sure that I will find it very interesting! I am a 22 year old from the island of Malta (a tiny 122 sq.mile island 60 miles south of Italy, right in the middle of the Mediterranean Sea). Having been interested in UFOs/aliens/life beyond earth, etc, for as long as I can remember I formed a local UFO research group together with a few of my friends almost a year ago. We now number 74 members, and have collected several interesting UFO sightings that took place over the Maltese islands over the past 50 years (details of which can be found on my web site - URL in sig below). A.J. Craddock wrote : >The other was a stolen clip from one of the security camera's on (as I >recall) the 5th level down at Area 51 in the underground complex, which >showed five or six gray-type ET's preserved in some kind of vertical >transparent liquid-filled storage capsules. There was also an interview (by >Wendelle Stevens) with the renegade security guard who was now on the run. If I remember correctly, that video clip was not the original one but a recreation of the event done by a Japanese researcher/TV studio. If anyone has any news on what has happened re this matter please post it on the list or reply to me personally .. i.e. was it a hoax? does the guard exist? .. does the video exist? .. has it been released? Regards, JJ Mercieca .----------------------------------------------------. * ~ MALTA UFO RESEARCH ~ * * Researcher & Investigator : John Joseph Mercieca * '----------------------------------------------------' * MUFOR Web site : http://www.waldonet.net.mt/~mufor/* * E-mail 1 : mufor@maltanet.omnes.net * * E-mail 2 : mufor@waldonet.net.mt * * IRC channel : #cydonia (on Undernet) * * Fax : + 356 456729 .'--------------. * Mobile : 099 0756 * "Either these * * Postal Address : P.O. Box 14, Rabat RBT 01, MALTA. * features on * '-------.-------------------------------------------.' Mars are * * natural and this investigation is a complete waste of time,* *or they are artificial and this is one of the most important* * discoveries of our entire existence on Earth." * * - RICHARD C.HOAGLAND on the MONUMENTS of CYDONIA, MARS * '------------------------------------------------------------' Message #7
From: Sia Ahmadzadeh <sia@UTSW.SWMED.EDU> Subject: RE: AREA 51: Groom Lake UFO Video Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 09:06:55 -0500 Unfortunately, I have to agree with Ken about Deb's video. It's kind of = exciting to think that it COULD be a UFO, but if you watch the video = objectively, it is obvious that it would be easy to create such a piece = with only an interesting full moon with some light cloud cover. still lookin...... Sia Ahmadzadeh sia@swmed.edu Aside from the annoying all caps text at this site, this video clip does nothing to convince me that this is "scientific proof" of UFO's in the = skies over Groom Lake. I was in the Groom Lake area around the time that this = was shot, and this looks like a shot of the Moon through thick cloud cover = to me. The motion itself is somewhat interesting, but it cannot be = determined whether it's the object or the camera that's moving, as the object = appears in total blackness, with no points of reference as to its apparent size = or location in the area. I respect The Deb's intentions, but this can hardly be called = "scientific proof"... =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Ken MacGray, Administrator - Virtual Village BBS Central Massachusetts' Premier Online Service 508-368-4222 - email:mayor@tiac.net - http://www.tiac.net/users/mayor Area 51 Images/Lore/News: http://www.tiac.net/users/mayor/a51/a51.html =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Message #8
From: Chuck Penson <penson@sci.mus.mn.us> Subject: A fire at Groom Lake? Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 10:10:51 -0600 On a hike to Tikaboo peak on Monday August 12 1996 my wife and I observed what appeared to be a fire burning on or near the base at Groom Lake. We arrived on the peak at about 11:30 AM. We scanned the base with binoculars and did not notice anything unusual. Then, about 10 minutes later (around 11:40 AM), we observed a bright orange point-source of light that flickered for more than an hour. This source of light was clearly visible to the unaided eye but could not be further resolved with 8 power binoculars. The flickering light occasionally became very bright, appearing to flare up, and at other times was very faint. At no time was it more than a point-source and at no time did we observe any smoke. The location of the event was just to the left and slightly above the only large hanger that can be seen with the unaided eye--at least by *my* unaided eye. The location appeared to be on a hillside beyond the hanger and near the west side of the base. I should add that the weather was very good that day and that much of the event was seen under full sun. After noon the clouds began to build and isolated showers developed. We would have stayed longer but we felt that the weather (and lightning) might become a problem. I have about 10 minutes of video tape of this event, but the tape doesn't reveal any additional details. The color of the event is also not well reproduced and appears only as a flickering white spot. I would be happy to answer any questions and can be contacted directly at : penson@sci.mus.mn.us -- Chuck Penson Mpls MN Message #9
From: Dave B <bethland@ix.netcom.com> Subject: Yucca Mountain campaign Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 13:45:42 -0500 AM-Nuclear Ads, Bjt,0840 Nuclear Industry Leaning on Clinton By H. JOSEF HEBERT= Associated Press Writer= WASHINGTON (AP) _ Call the toll-free number and a voice tells you how many tons of nuclear waste there are in Michigan, or in Illinois _ and then you may be switched to the Clinton re-election campaign, so you can complain. It's all part of a million-dollar radio, television and print advertising campaign by the nuclear power industry in important election states. The aim: put pressure on President Clinton to support a proposed nuclear waste dump in Nevada. The ad campaign, including the toll-free number, was begun in Illinois at the time of the Democratic National Convention, but now has been expanded to include Michigan, another key state for Clinton's re-election hopes. In coming weeks, the ads probably will appear in other election battleground states, including Pennsylvania and Ohio, say industry spokesmen. Joe Colvin, president of the Nuclear Energy Institute, the Washington-based group that represents the nuclear industry, said the campaign is not intended to be partisan, but is aimed at Clinton's promised veto of legislation that would create the Nevada disposal site. "This is a national issue that needs to be solved. We want the president and his people to hear from the public on how important it is," said Colvin in an interview. He argues the government promised to take the waste off industry hands. Scott Peterson, the institute's director of communications, said about 3,000 callers have been connected with Clinton-Gore campaign offices, mostly in Illinois and Michigan where the group has bought radio ads in a dozen cities as well as television and print ads in Chicago and Detroit. Campaign and White House officials have complained to the industry group about the calls being automatically forwarded, arguing it amounts to harassment. But Craig Southerland, a spokesman for the Clinton-Gore campaign in Illinois, said the office is taking the calls in stride, advising callers to contact the White House. "I'm not sure who to complain to," he said, adding that the callers include both Clinton supporters and critics. "From our standpoint we've been very successful," said Peterson, the industry spokesman. He said the ad campaign, which he estimated has cost a little over $1 million so far, would continue up to election day in key electoral states with concentrations of nuclear reactors. Illinois, with 13 reactors, generates more nuclear power than any other state, while Michigan has five reactors and Pennsylvania has nine. Together they have more than 7,000 tons of nuclear spent fuel in storage at the reactor sites. And all of the states, with their large blocs of electoral votes, are important to Clinton's re-election. So far, the ads and telephone calls haven't budged the president into changing his mind about the proposed Nevada site. He has committed to Nevada's governor and the state's two senators that he will veto any legislation that forces the state to accept the waste. The squabbles over nuclear waste _ about 30,000 tons of spent nuclear fuel now at reactors in 31 states _ has been going on for years. In July, the Senate voted 63-37 to put the interim waste storage facility in Nevada, where the government also is trying to determine the suitability of an underground permanent storage facility. House action is still uncertain. Administration officials have argued that the Senate-approved proposal would circumvent environmental protections and could sidetrack efforts to build the permanent underground waste repository. Nevada's senators have argued that the tons of spent fuel are being stored safely at reactor sites anyway, and should be kept there. While the nuclear industry agrees about the safety of local storage _ though they say it's too expensive and politically troublesome _ its ads heard in such cities as Peoria, Ill., and Kalamazoo, Mich., in recent weeks, come across with a tone of urgency, even danger. "Radioactive nuclear waste! It just keeps piling up ... tons of it. Near our homes, jobs, schools," an announcer warns ominously in one ad. "Congress says `Move the nuclear waste _ now.' But Bill Clinton says `no.' Pile it up. Wait. Do nothing." A newspaper ad shows an aerial view of metropolitan Chicago next to a view of the Nevada desert. "Where should nuclear waste be stored? Take your pick," it reads. The ads _ both print and broadcast _ urge callers to use a toll-free number if they are concerned. A woman named Cynthia answered one such call one recent evening in Springfield, Mich., and began by ticking off statistics on the amount of nuclear waste in Iowa, Illinois and Michigan. In case the caller was in a mood to take the matter further, she was eager to help. "We have the ability to connect you to the Clinton-Gore headquarters," she said _ and did. (Copyright 1996 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.) APTV-09-16-96 1257CDT > Dave B in Houston Message #10
From: tonydinkel@clubnet.net (Tony Dinkel) Subject: Re: AREA 51: A fire at Groom Lake? Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1996 13:53:12 -0800 >around 11:40 AM), we observed a bright orange point-source of >light that flickered for more than an hour. This source of light was >clearly visible to the unaided eye but could not be further resolved >with 8 power binoculars. I have noticed the the military (and NASA) likes to burn off exess fuel a lot. The bright orange seems to suggest liquid hydrogen possibly? Do any of the aerial photos or maps show evidence of a burn pond? TD Message #11
From: Joseph C Yasinski <jcy@U.Arizona.EDU> Subject: Re: AREA 51: How much would YOU pay for this info? Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 19:08:15 -0700 (MST) Although I think that your intuition is correct is it possible that you were a bit too combative? Chances are this is a hoax, but what if the information he has is legitamate? Perhaps if you had said that you would be very interested in the information abd gave your reasons for not offering money he would given you the info. I just don't think it was necessary to be so abrasive. Joe Yasinski "How do you shoot the devil in the back..What if you miss?" Joseph C Yasinski jcy@U.Arizona.EDU Message #12
From: Joseph C Yasinski <jcy@U.Arizona.EDU> Subject: Re: AREA 51: A fire at Groom Lake? Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 19:10:53 -0700 (MST) I was on top of tikaboo in late August. Me and my partner saw clouds of smoke so thick that they clouded up the sun. The burned for at least 3 hours. We have pictures if they can be of use to anyone. Joe Yasinski "How do you shoot the devil in the back..What if you miss?" Joseph C Yasinski jcy@U.Arizona.EDU Message #13
From: Joseph C Yasinski <jcy@U.Arizona.EDU> Subject: Re: AREA 51: Area-51 discussion IRC Channel... Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 19:14:21 -0700 (MST) I was wondering if anyone would be interested in meeting at a particular time at #groomlake on irc? If enough interest is posted I would like to have everyone meet there som evening this week. How about 7pm on thursday MST? Drop a line and let me know. Joe Yasinski "How do you shoot the devil in the back..What if you miss?" Joseph C Yasinski jcy@U.Arizona.EDU Message #14
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Created: 16 Sep 1996